Neil Dudley: The Cowboy Perspective, well, it might be hard to define, but I guarantee if you think about it, you’ve got one in mind. Whether you’re building a legacy, an empire, or a fan base, I bet when your friends look at you, they see some cowboy in your face. Y’all come along, let’s talk about this or that. Maybe when we’re done, you’ll go away with another perspective to put under your hat.
Hey, everybody. Welcome to the South Texas Dove Hunting Episode. I’m really looking forward to sharing this kind of conversation and this group of guys with all the listeners, and we threw in a little special conversation between me and Johnny, the guy that helps me produce the Cowboy Perspective. All in all, it’s fun. I hope it’s entertaining. I hope there’s some nuggets of information that you find valuable. That is the point of doing the Cowboy Perspective podcast and I hope that’s what really happens for you as a listener. I’m going to ask you please share it, tell a friend. If you’re listening and you enjoyed this, go back and check out some of the other episodes and give me feedback and tell a friend, share it, hit the subscribe button. That’s how we grow this thing and make it bigger and better. Now, let’s get to the show. I hope you enjoy it. Thanks for listening.
Alright, fellas. Thanks for coming. Like I’ve invited you to do some crazy ass shit. All we’re going to do is right now get an introduction. So, we’ll start at my left. Well, if you’re listening, I hope you know who I am. Because this is all being recorded for the Cowboy Perspective Podcast, worldwide famously known for jack shit. Okay so, Brett, tell everybody who you are.
Brett Wilson: Well, my name is Brett Wilson, live in Comanche, Texas.
Neil Dudley: Don’t tell them that. We don’t want them to know where you live in case you say something they don’t like. I’m joking.
Brett Wilson: Don’t come looking for me. I work down at a Bayer Ford.
Neil Dudley: Alright, cool. Since Brett didn’t add much color, I’ll add the color for him. He’s got a wife and a couple of kids, and he’s done several things. He’s lived up in the metroplex. He’s moved out to the country. So, part of the perspective he’ll add to this conversation is going to be valuable to me in that way. And what we’ve got is a bunch of kind of interesting guys. We’ve gone to a hunting lodge, thanks to Signature Outdoors for kind of hosting us, or Signature Hunting Company. Hell, I really don’t know – something Signature in their logo. I know that much, a guy named Kyle. Lee kind of put it together for us. Lee, why don’t we- tell everybody who you are and don’t let your voice sound scratchy.
Lee Gore: Does this work now? Do you want my sexy voice?
Neil Dudley: No, yodel for us. That’d be even better.
Lee Gore: So, Lee Gore. [Back on] cleanup today. Looking to get some RBIs or come up for a little dove hunt. We got Kyle Crouch is the guy that’s ramrodding this Signature Hunting Company event for us. We were all sitting around on a patio probably back in May or June for a birthday party of one of our good buddies’ wives. And we’re like, holy crap, our women always go on these girls’ trips and do all kinds of fun stuff. And us guys, we just get beat up all the time. We are having to clean and do the laundry, do the dishes, make all this money. And our wives, they got it made, them girls, but we’re proud of them, them wives, they work hard. And we said let’s put a trip together, go on a little hunting trip. And I said what do you guys want to do? Y’all want to go shoot pigs, you do some hog hunting, whatever. And we said let’s do some dove hunting. So, we put this thing together. I hunt with Kyle quite a bit with customers and stuff. And he runs a good show down here. He’s got some good outfitters helping him, guides, got a lot of good places to hunt on. And had been talking to him about it, and I thought, man, I’ll put this together and got eight of us to come down here and just spend a couple of days and unwind and-
Neil Dudley: Come on over Kyle, you can’t just pretend like you had to take an important phone call and get away.
Lee Gore: Anything else you want to know, Neil?
Neil Dudley: No, that sounds good. Tell everybody a little bit about your career. That’s kind of one of the cool things that I’m going to enjoy about once we start throwing some topics out and batting them around is everybody’s got a little bit of a different career path they’ve been on. So just add that a little bit.
Lee Gore: That’s cool, man. Thanks for asking. So, I’ve had the opportunity to work in a family farm, a dairy farm operation, feed mill operation for many, many years. We were a 50 year plus old family operation. I was one of the fourth generations, and believe it or not, Neil’s wife is in the family as well. And we were both part of that fourth generation that you watched our grandparents, great grandparents, and our parents build this thing up. And it sold and we left, and we actually had left before that. And then, left the family operation, got into dairy chemical business where I got to really learn about traveling all over the world. A good old country boy from small town America gets to go see all kinds of places in Europe and North America, Mexico, you just name it. And really then it was what drove my career to getting into sales, sales management, and things like that. And left there, went to an animal health company where we did pharmaceuticals, biologicals, things like that. We’re helping with mergers acquisitions, sales training, just building the sales teams up on the dairy sector that way. Got out of agriculture actually for about 18 months. It was the worst, best thing a man could ever do in his career in my shoes. It humbled me, it brought me back to my roots and realized how much agriculture was important to me. And then two and a half years ago, got into a company that I dearly love and to a product realm I never thought I’d be into, more of like the microbial world of things, where we’re doing bacteria and enzymes and cultures. And never dreamed I’d be into technology and science like this. And ten and half years later, still doing it. I’m the director of sales for North America. Got a great group of people I get to work with. Get to travel a lot, see a lot of stuff, work for a great company. And man, I’m blessed beyond belief to be where I’m at today.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that’s cool. We hang out quite a bit just because we do. We like to do the same things. And it always is fun to tap your brain about what you think about sales or how to get better at sales, how to support a team, build a team. So, that’s kind of Lee’s background. Matter of fact, Lee’s got a guy he works with here with us. So, Andy Moore, you’re up. Tell us who you are. By the way, guns up. This guy’s from Lubbock, Texas.
Andy Moore: Andy Moore, Lubbock, Texas. I’ve worked for Lee for almost eight years, doing his grunt work, making him look good.
Lee Gore: And that he does.
Andy Moore: Been in the dairy and feedlot business working for Lee for, like I said, almost eight years. Live in Lubbock. What else?
Neil Dudley: Well, see, I don’t know any color about you, so you’re going to have to add your own color.
Andy Moore: That comes later when I’m drunk.
Neil Dudley: By the way, we’re going to record this again in another few hours after we all went and-
Lee Gore: I’ll add some color for Andy Moore, I know Andy pretty well. So, Andy is going to be a father in February for the first time. So that’s pretty darn exciting.
Andy Moore: Amen.
Lee Gore: He’s passionate about his Texas Tech Red Raiders. He tailgates quite a bit, I’d say, at the football games, he can cook probably one of the best steaks a man can get in America. And if you want to rile him up, just start messing with him and you can get this boy riled up in a hurry.
Neil Dudley: Alright, cool. The next guy we’ll bring up to the microphone is Kyle. He’s kind of hosting the group. So, Kyle, get up here and tell us all a little bit about who you are and might as well say something about your company.
Kyle Crouch: Yes, sir. Thank you. It’s Kyle Crouch, and I’m with Signature Hunting. I’ve been doing it now for about 18 years. We do whitetail, exotics, and some open bird-
Neil Dudley: Bull shit. You’re not old enough to have been doing this for 18 years.
Kyle Crouch: Yup, started young, just went from the bottom to where I’m at, so it’s been good.
Neil Dudley: Alright, cool. Well, do you have a girlfriend or a wife or a family?
Kyle Crouch: I’ve got a fiancée, yes sir. Yeah, I do good. Got a couple boys.
Neil Dudley: Okay. Look, you got the guy- I’m worried about this already, because I know you got the best stories of anybody, and you’re already getting nervous about that. Now you don’t have to give names to the stories. You can just say these guys. These guys come out on this hunt, and they start podcasting and shit, I mean, they’re just the most ridiculous people. We’re going to be getting some of those stories out of you later. Thanks for getting on here. But running an outfitter to me has got to be a really cool thing. I think you get access to a lot of different clientele, businessmen and women that come and do these things. So, I got to believe that you have a chance at learning some things in all those situations.
Kyle Crouch: Oh yes, sir. Yeah.
Lee Gore: Man, I’d be worried.
Neil Dudley: This is going to be my goal of the weekend is get Kyle to say something more than yes, sir, yep, no, thank you. Alright, Justin, tell me a little bit about you.
Justin Holland: Justin Holland, chiropractor, got a wife and a couple of kids, and I’m kind of like Kyle, I’m a man of few words.
Neil Dudley: Well, we’ll get you- I think we’ll get to talking about some of the topics that we’ll address or just start kicking out there for conversation starters, and everybody might have something to add along the way. And if you don’t, that’s fine too. I know Justin a little bit, just we grew up in the same town and have known his family for years and years. And so, I appreciate and respect his viewpoint on a lot of things. He’s the only doctor in the bunch – well, I don’t know, does chiropracting count as doctoring?
Justin Holland: I do have doctor at the first of my name.
Neil Dudley: Yes. So, there we go. Anybody who starts heaving or having big trouble, Justin’s in charge.
Lee Gore: I’m just going to kick him really hard.
Neil Dudley: That’s right. Okay, Tanner Spear, you’re up.
Tanner Spears: Hey there, this is Tanner Spears.
Neil Dudley: It’s got an S at the end of it. That’s my fault.
Tanner Spears: I guess I’m the new guy to the group, but I’ve got a lovely wife and a new baby boy. So, I’m I am a family man. And I heard Neil tell everybody earlier that I’m the insurance guy, but I do sell insurance, mostly focused on larger commercial accounts. So maybe just a little different job than most people around the table. But yeah, glad to be here.
Neil Dudley: Well, and is insurance guy offensive?
Tanner Spears: I don’t think so, not for me.
Neil Dudley: Alright good. Yeah, but that’s I think a perspective that nobody has. That’s why I think this would be such a cool time to record a conversation between this group of guys because it’s almost such a very dynamic different group, and who knows what we’ll end up talking about. Of course, we’ve already been talking about child trafficking and all kinds of stuff and that’s a sad thing.
Lee Gore: We don’t like the child trafficking, let’s clear that up.
Neil Dudley: That’s right, a hundred percent. But you chuckle a little bit because you start revealing some of the truth of what goes on when you get together with people you like, respect, and the things you start asking each other about and wondering, is this for real? And so, what we’ll end up doing at some point, maybe multiple times, we catch ourselves kind of talking about this or that, we’ll try to jump here and get- And by the way, Johnny Peterson’s with us on the hunt. He’s running the controls of the recorders and mics, making sure we get this all recorded in a decent format, so it’d be worth something to somebody. Alright so, who wants it-? Let’s just try it once. Put a topic on the table and let’s talk. How about this, Andy, tell us a little bit about your perspective on Joe Biden. I did hear not too long, or at least recently you’ve had some signs supporting the Biden campaign appear in your yard. What happened there? By the way in the group, if you are a Biden supporter, you’re welcome.
Justin Holland: They’re sleeping outside.
Neil Dudley: In this particular case, I have a decent suspicion that most everybody leans in the kind of conservative direction or healthy economy direction. Okay. So, tell us about Biden.
Lee Gore: That’s a nice way to put it – a healthy economy.
Andy Moore: Well, I had a colleague up in Wisconsin who thought it’d be quite funny, being somebody who is conservative, to send campaign people for Joe Biden and put a sign in my yard. Well, unbeknownst to me, this is all going on behind the scenes with a couple of other colleagues. And I was carrying out the trash, come back to the house, and he pulls up, and “I’m here to put out signs.” And I’m like, “Buddy, this is nothing but a big joke.” And long story short, he got upset. I got upset. Kind of got put on the spot and don’t really want to give too much.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that’s fine. That might not even be something worth putting in the show. I’m just kind of trying to spur conversation and maybe we’ll wait until everybody gets a few more beers down so we can talk about this or that. Alright, here you go. This is the real- to start the podcast, everybody’s got to take a shot of whiskey.
Lee Gore: Negatory Ghost Rider.
Neil Dudley: Well, no, but I think we can parlay some of what Andy was saying to business or to a little bit more valuable thing is why do you think or tell me a little bit about what it is like working with people that will play jokes on you and stuff like that. Do you ever play jokes on somebody else? Do you think that makes your job more enjoyable?
Andy Moore: I think yes, because it brings more comradery with the group, whether it be different values or different beliefs, it just, we’re all one going for the same goal in my opinion.
Neil Dudley: That’s right. I think for the listeners out there, the nugget of information I think is so valuable there is, hey, we work together, we’re trying to build a company, we’re trying to have success together, but we can also give each other shit. I mean, we can joke, we can mess with Andy a little bit. He might end up trying to get me back later and that’s all just fine. That’s part of probably building a team and being on a team. So, what about Cole Parks? There’s another guy coming, and he got his truck stolen in San Antonio on the way down here. So, when he gets here, we’ll have to ask him all about that. But if you’ve ever had your vehicle stolen, it makes you appreciate thieves a lot less.
Quick pause, just to say I hope you know who Peterson Natural Farms is. If you don’t, go check them out, www.petersonsfarms.com. If you have any questions, hit me up. I’ve been working with Peterson’s and my best friend since kindergarten and his wife and my wife and a whole bunch of other really great people for about 20 years now, building a brand and a bunch of products that we think really add value to people’s healthy lifestyles. And I like to say the Cowboy Perspective Podcast is a labor of love that I kind of do in my spare time. And I hope to just bring value, tell stories about people that affect me and give me the perspective I have. And I don’t want to steal that labor of love line from Mr. Douglas Burdett, the host of the Marketing Book Podcast without giving him some credit. There’s another something I’d tell you – if you are into building a brand or an entrepreneur of any sort or salesperson of any sort, go listen to the Marketing Book podcast. He reviews great authors’ books about sales and marketing. So, Peterson Natural Farms, go check them out. Thank you for listening to the Cowboy Perspective. Here’s some more.
Alright so, it’s the morning after the first night of hunting here at the what is it? The Bluff Spring Lodge down around Bandera. I got the guys circled up. I’m going to ask them a question. We’re going to talk about it. By the way, Cole, introduce yourself because you weren’t here yesterday when you had a chance. Tell the listeners a little bit about who you are, where you come from, what you do.
Cole Parks: My name’s Cole Gilliam Parks. I’m with Southwestern Group. We have retail and wholesale financial services company offices in Stephenville, Fort Worth, and Austin.
Neil Dudley: There you go. Pretty good. To add a little color to that, he’s a big feller, stands about 6’5”, weighs 220. Maybe that’s a little low on the weight. I don’t know.
Cole Parks: That’s perfect actually.
Neil Dudley: Alright, good. Okay. So, here’s the topic for this morning. Everybody’s in business of some sort and works either with people, for people, hiring, thinking about how you’re going to build your company. So maybe I’ll start with, I don’t know who wants to take it? Raise your hand if you’d be interested or have an opinion. What kind of people, let’s say we’ve got listeners and they might want to build their business or be a part of a growing business, what kind of people are you guys looking for to hire and to help grow your business? Lee?
Lee Gore: I suggest we put a spin on this, and we ask someone like more or less over here with Andy and with someone that works with people, what kind of people he wants to work with to build a team, to be part of a great team. Instead of us being from the inside out, let’s go from the outside in perspective.
Neil Dudley: Well, yeah, I think we’ve got all of those perspectives here. Andy, as you’re kind of, you guys, have an interesting relationship because you work together for real. The rest of us are kind of all done our own things, or we don’t have parts of our team here. What’s your perspective on that?
Andy Moore: Well, that was the spin I was going to take it. Integrity is huge. Having like a boss or fellow employees having your back. But it goes back to integrity and just somebody that you trust, whether it be a friendship or relationship, you got to be able to trust somebody. If you’re going to do business with somebody, people want to do business with people they trust, people they like. It’s all in a relationship. And like Lee and I’s relationship, we knew each other prior to me going to work for him. And we were actually somewhat competitors. And we work in the same circle of people and just word travels.
Neil Dudley: Well, as you know, I’m out there looking to hire people pretty much 24/7, all the time. Because in order to grow, what’s your number one asset? That’s the people within a company. So, I’m curious, does anybody have an opinion on whether or not the people you work with or hire, look to hire need to have a college degree? Yes, no? I mean, I can give you mine, but I’d be interested in what y’all think.
Cole Parks: I’ll jump in there. And our office doesn’t require a college degree. We do require licensing to go in there. But no, we don’t require a college degree. We actually don’t even ask. If they offer great, but-
Neil Dudley: Why not?
Cole Parks: It’s one of those things that there’s different types of people out there. And in today’s marketplace, I’ve had a lot more success hiring people without a college degree that recognized they could come out of high school and find an opportunity making six figures without the degree. They have gumption, they had drive. And I’m not saying anything against people that have a college degree. They have a lot of skillsets that come also, but that doesn’t necessarily give you a leg up. I can tell you on the flip side of that, I’ve seen people that we’ve hired with college degrees that are more entitled, and they’re expecting to do a lot of things just because they have that degree that they’re not ready for.
Neil Dudley: I would, I think, I want to say I think the world has changed a lot. The perspective of business owners might be that that education really doesn’t- And especially now with COVID and all this kind of remote stuff, how much are people really learning? Brett, what do you think about that? So, in what you do, you’re dealing with a lot of, I don’t know, what’s the turnover like at your job and how does that work?
Brett Wilson: I’ll tell you, the turnover in my department has been very scarce. There’s not a lot of turnover, which is great. We’re thinking about employee retention here and how do you retain these guys? And it starts from the top I think, and the workplace, and I was telling my wife just the other day, it’s like, man, I spend more time at work with these people than I spend at home with you guys. Typically, I get home at 5:30 and in bed by 10:00. I’m at work 10 hours a day. So, having those employees, we are kind of like a close-knit family, I would say, at work, and we all get along great. Like I said, the turnover, we just don’t have any, which is great. I enjoy my staff and we all just get through it. And talking about really hiring these guys and what you’re looking for, I’m thinking that, and I always tell these new guys, and a lot of them are younger, late twenties, early thirties, we’re striving to be better. This is what we do. We got to stay on the cutting edge of technology. And we’re always learning, always training.
Neil Dudley: Are those people you are hiring mechanics or shop floor inventory specialists? Like what-? I would think a mechanic’s going to have to go get some training somewhere.
Brett Wilson: Yes, yes, we require they are continuously training. It’s always-
Neil Dudley: Those vehicles are evolving so fast. There’s no way to keep up with it if you’re not going to get some training. So, Tanner, in the business you’re in- Oh yeah, by the way, Brett, good job. What are you looking for when you’re out there hiring people? Or are you hiring people? Oh, and one real quick question – anybody around this table right now today not have a college degree?
Cole Parks: I do not.
I do not either.
Neil Dudley: Okay. So, two of the, what do we got here, seven guys don’t have college degrees and I’d call them successful. So, if you’re out there listening and you’re thinking you got to have a college degree to be successful, well, there’s proof right around this table you don’t. Okay, Tanner, tell us what you think about, what’s your perspective on it?
Tanner Spears: So, to answer your question, we’re definitely hiring. We’re always looking for new talent. A lot of times, that don’t just come knock on your door, so you have to go find them. But I think a college degree is not necessary, but it does look good on a resume. What we’re after is if somebody wants to come join our organization, you’re going to have to be willing to get educated. You don’t have to bring that skill when you show up, but you’re going to have to learn that skill.
Neil Dudley: That’s so great. That’s perfect.
Justin Holland: And we can send you to school or train you, but in my profession, you are required to have continuing education every year. So, a lot of people can take that continuing education and funnel that to a new skill by learning mandatory hours that they have to take anyways. So, you’re always going to be having to learn and continuing your education.
Neil Dudley: Well, that’s at least for you and Cole in this group, you kind of have to have certifications. You got to get licensed to do the things you’re doing. I don’t experience that. I did try to get a real estate license once, but I failed the test two times and decided I’d try something else. But so, when the licensing piece comes, well even Justin, if you’re going to be a chiropractor, you’ve got to kind of go get some schooling in order to even open that office. And you do a lot of other things besides chiropracting. So, talk a little bit about your perspective on this idea of people and growing your team and getting better, or how people help or make it a challenge to be successful.
Justin Holland: Yeah. The biggest thing I would say, just kind of what Tanner said, is you got to be able to learn, want to be coachable or teachable.
Neil Dudley: How do you know if somebody is able to do that? Like that’s the most crazy thing to me. How do you ferret that out? Because people can turn in this great resume – oh, I was the president of the this or that, and I got a 4.0, but they don’t know how to learn.
Justin Holland: Yeah. And just from what I’ve seen over through the years is the ones, like you said, that they’re 4.0, they’re very smart. They know everything. Those are the worst, worst ones to have, because they-
Neil Dudley: Do you think it’d be worth- if you’re listening and you make a 4.0, lie.
Justin Holland: Not to take away from somebody who’s like that.
Neil Dudley: Oh yeah. Well, and they worked hard to have that.
Justin Holland: And so, like when I was in chiropractic school, and they told us this in school, they said that the students who do the best, who make the 4.0, usually are not the best chiropractors. And they can teach, they make better teachers than they do going out and with the public and face-to-face and being successful businessman, I guess you’d say, and women. But my biggest thing is show up. Just be on time. The way I was raised, if you’re not there five minutes early, you’re late. So that’s the biggest thing with me is just show up.
Neil Dudley: That’s right. I call that cowboy time. Cowboy time is 15 minutes early or you’re late, five minutes. Don’t like, if you’re not there early, you’re late.
Justin Holland: They’re leaving you.
Neil Dudley: And that happened to me at time or because that’s how I learned that lesson. What about men and women? Do you see any difference there? I have an opinion here, I guess that’s why I’m asking the question, because I find that there’s a certain gender a lot of times that’s an easier path that are just kind of used to working for it a little harder, I think. Anybody got thoughts on that?
Tanner Spears: I’ll jump in here. Oh, sorry-
Justin Holland: No, I was just going to say, what do you mean as far as men and women? Like, what’s your question, I guess?
Neil Dudley: In your experience, have you found out that you would rather hire a man or a woman?
Cole Parks: I guess I can’t shake my head on a microphone here.
Neil Dudley: Cole’s shaking his head. I’ll be the commentator. Everybody looked at me like are you really asking this question?
Lee Gore: I have some really good input in this, but I’ll let everybody else go.
Brett Wilson: Neil, the thing is in my business, it’s always been more or less a man’s world in the shop. Okay so, I just hired recently a female to work in the shop. And it has been excellent.
Neil Dudley: I think the reason- Oh, Lee, tell us what your thought is there. You said you had a good one.
Lee Gore: So, for you guys that don’t know, I work for a large global company with 4,000 employees. 400 of those are in North America, and a large portion of them are on my team. And we are diversified very well with men, women, different cultures, different races, different thoughts. And we are equal opportunity employer. We look at it and I’ll be honest with you, we are adding more females to our team versus males at this point. And to be honest with you, the passion, the quality of work, the dedication, the attention to detail, the customer centricity with a female as an account manager on our team, 90% of the time is hands down more successful and more engaging than the males that we hire or the men that we hire in our company. And we have made a true pact to ourselves to add more, whether it’s tech service, whether it’s salespeople, and even in management roles, bringing women to the group. And the thing is they want to be listened to. They are very detailed. They want to work hard because they are becoming more and more of the revenue generator for their family as well, and they want to do something. And I hate to say this, I think men, the younger generation of men, don’t take this wrong, don’t understand the work ethic. Like a lot of us grew up in small town America or an agriculture, we worked our butts off and it’s tough to find that. And I think that’s where the women are stepping up, taking a lead on that. And I have no problem bringing a female on our team. We’re adding them all the time. And it’s great to be honest with you.
Neil Dudley: When I’m out there looking, I almost give them a little bit of a, I’m almost leaning more towards the females in today’s, I don’t know. I try, I really- that probably is maybe not very good advice because a good person is a good person, whether they’re black, gray, brown, white, male, female, anything. As a kind of middle-class male, white guy, and a guy that’s now a dad of three daughters, I think I’m starting to be more aware and open to the idea that females are discriminated against in our world. Like even we just have this little cornhole board, and we write down the winners of the cornhole tournaments in our house when we have get-togethers and stuff. And one day I put a co-ed section. Why the hell did I need to put a co-ed section? Because I have an internal bias against women. It’s like, oh, well, the co-ed section’s not as cool as the all-male side. And that’s real. And they deal with that. And it’s, I don’t want to be that way, but if I’m going to be honest and speak about it honestly, that’s true. And I wouldn’t want my girls to have to deal with that. Like oh yeah, well y’all can only be in the coed game. There’s no all-female side, and this all-male, this is really where all the important wins happen. So, if you’re out there and you experience that or you think about that-
Cole Parks: I’ll jump in there too. To Lee’s point, in our office, in practices across the board I’ve been using for about 10 years now, one of the tools that we use when we’re hiring and sourcing talent is, and this isn’t a pitch or anything obviously, but the Kolbe process, and that’s K O L B E. We’ve been doing it for years because it helps us identify what skill sets we need in specific positions. And then male, female doesn’t matter. They, the candidates go and they take these quizzes, and it tells us what they’re naturally drawn to do. So are they going to be a quick starter and they’re going to be great at customer service, and we can identify if they’re going to be a good fit before we’ve even hired them on to the team. So that right there is-
Neil Dudley: Do you feel like that, does that thing usually ring true?
Cole Parks: It rings scary, accurately true a lot of the times, because it’s not questions that you would think. And so, if you’re kind of going through this process and you’re saying, alright, this position, I need this type of skillset. And I might like Justin, he’s a great guy and we can drink beer together, and he’s a good fit and people like him, but I’m hiring him to do X and he is really comfortable doing Y, it’s going to be something out of his comfort zone to make him move over here.
Neil Dudley: Well, you won’t get as good a result either.
Cole Parks: And so regardless of male or female, we kind of start there. And that allows us to go through and identify this person, this candidate is going to be great in this position, regardless of who they are.
Lee Gore: And I would reiterate what Cole is saying, I was going to bring that up is when we look at talent, whether they have a college degree, whether they don’t, whether they have a masters, an MBA, whatever the degree is in. And like I said, if they don’t, we look at it different ways. We have, I have successful people on my team that have no degree. I have people that have MBAs that are successful. They have Master of Science degrees. They have bachelor’s degrees. They’re all over the place. But we look at an OMS process when they take a personality profile. We look at the personality profile and the way it is is you get the person’s natural profile, and you get what they perceive themselves as. So, you can look at it and you get so these indicators show up and it’s amazing how these indicators show up. So, I’m a quick detail, not really into the deep detail person. So, I have people that’s on my team that want all the details. So, what I do is I understand how people want to be communicated with and how they learn, because it’s not the same as myself. So just because someone doesn’t match up my profile doesn’t mean they can’t be successful. So, what we’ve learned is we learn how to coach and train that person to fit. And there’s been times we’ve turned people away that are super good candidates, but they don’t fit our position properly. They’re good people. They just, we don’t have the right culture for them.
Neil Dudley: Oh yeah. It’s all the trick of building the team and putting the people in the right seat of the bus.
Lee Gore: And one thing I do is we make people go through an interview process with about six people. If someone’s going to come to my team, they’ll go through two or three interviews before they come to me. And then they come to me and then I send them to our VP, our country VP, and he and I will talk about them. And we have an interview process that we go through and if they don’t check three or four of these criteria automatically, we disqualify them right away. If they don’t hit all four of those qualifiers, they are done automatically. And people say, well, I really like- well, just because you like, you have to take your personal emotion out of it, because that might not be the right fit for our team. And once my managers have learned these criteria, they have got, we’ve assembled a really incredible sales team of people. And our turnover rate is pretty much zero.
Cole Parks: It’s done on the hiring side. Y’all knew going into it.
Lee Gore: And then what you do when you bring a good person on, if you don’t have a good onboarding program, you will lose that person. We have a 180-day onboarding program, and people think why do you have a six-month onboarding program? And we give them mentors in our company that’s other than their manager, because if you don’t, they’re going to, you’re going to neglect them. And they’re not going to ask the proper questions because they’re going to be afraid to ask their manager three or four times. But if they have a mentor that has a territory similar to them, they can go to and ride with and spend time with, that makes them successful. And the reps, the new reps are in charge of monitoring their own onboarding program for the six months. It’s the manager’s job to follow up, but it’s the salesperson’s job to initiate it to grow so they can build relationships in the company and understand the know-how of what to do.
Neil Dudley: I need to hear that, I mean, I don’t, I’m terrible at the onboarding. I’m like, you’re hired, figure it out. That’s kind of how I work, and I know people get frustrated like that. Oh yeah, cool. Thanks everybody for your time. For the listeners, if you’re hearing a little bit of background noise, well that’s cause the cook’s ready. He’s got the food hot; we’re going to go get it.
Okay, folks, I got to tell you about Root & Roam Creative Studio, and in full disclosure, it is a company that my wife is CEO and founder of. So, I am going to be slightly biased in the way that I think she’s brilliant. But in all fairness and without bias, I will tell you her and the team there know what marketing is. They know how to tell a story and help you tell your story. So, if you’re looking to build a brand, sell a product, really about anything, there is a piece of marketing that goes with it that helps people know your story, who you are, and how they can interact with you. So over at Root & Roam Creative Studio, what they say is we inspire brands to make bold moves, to be the best version of themselves, to explore uncharted territories, to tell their stories. If you’re out there looking to do those things, please check out www.rootandroamcreative.com. I promise you they’ll love to help you, and you’ll be proud that you did. Thanks for listening. Back to the action.
Okay, this is the Sunday morning after a long day of dove hunting and beer drinking. And how does Doc Holiday say it? I have not yet begun to defile myself. Alright, cool. So, the game this morning is going to be, I’m going to just put some stuff out there on the table. We’ll start with Tanner, and we’ll just go around, and everybody kind of gets to say they’re answer. And then, if it turns out that we want to stop and talk a little more about somebody’s poor decision, we can do that. So, while everybody’s eating breakfast, we’re going to start posing a few questions or hey, pick this, rapid fire, going around the table. Tanner, you’re up. Beer or whiskey?
Tanner Spears: Beer.
Neil Dudley: Justin, Foxworthy or White?
Justin Holland: White.
Neil Dudley: Lee, orange or banana?
Lee Gore: Orange straight up with this crowd.
Neil Dudley: Andy, Advil or Tylenol?
Andy Moore: Tylenol.
Neil Dudley: Brett, Belushi or Farley?
Brett Wilson: Farley.
Neil Dudley: My question is blackjack or craps? Craps. Cole, salsa or queso?
Cole Parks: Queso.
Neil Dudley: Johnny, you got to get in on this one too. I’ll give the crowd- Okay, you can put it on there. Chappelle or Murphy?
Johnny Peterson: Chappelle.
Neil Dudley: Tanner, or Straight or Brooks?
Tanner Spears: Brooks.
Neil Dudley: Scrambled or fried?
Justin Holland: Scrambled.
Neil Dudley: Subway or a taxi?
Lee Gore: Neither.
Neil Dudley: You can’t do neither. You gotta pick one.
Lee Gore: Taxi.
Neil Dudley: Uber or Lyft?
Andy Moore: Uber.
Neil Dudley: Coors Light or Bud Light?
Brett Wilson: Coors Light.
Neil Dudley: Petersons or Applegate? Yes, I got that one for me out of pure randomness. Peterson’s. Work from office or home?
Cole Parks: Office.
Neil Dudley: Army or Navy?
Tanner Spears: Navy.
Justin Holland: Also Navy.
Neil Dudley: Plane or train? That’s you-
Justin Holland: Plane.
Neil Dudley: Okay, Justin, that’s fine. Give participation ribbons, yes or no?
Lee Gore: Negatory Ghost Rider.
Cole Parks: Amen.
Neil Dudley: Polaris or Kawasaki?
Andy Moore: Polaris.
Neil Dudley: Ford or Chevy?
Brett Wilson: I better say Ford.
Neil Dudley: Mine’s gold or silver? Silver. Bass or catfish?
Cole Parks: Bass.
Neil Dudley: Biscuit or toast?
Tanner Spears: Biscuit.
Neil Dudley: Roll or cornbread?
Justin Holland: Cornbread.
Neil Dudley: Buttermilk or sauerkraut?
Lee Gore: Sauerkraut, straight up.
Neil Dudley: Horseshoes or washers?
Andy Moore: Washers.
Neil Dudley: Shorts or pants?
Brett Wilson: Shorts.
Neil Dudley: Horses or cows? Horses. Dogs or cats?
Cole Parks: Dog.
Neil Dudley: Boots or shoes?
Tanner Spears: Boots.
Neil Dudley: Okay and if you’re working out, do you want to run or lift weights?
Justin Holland: Lift.
Neil Dudley: Work or vacation?
Lee Gore: Work.
Neil Dudley: Is that just politically correct there?
Lee Gore: Well, you got to work to go on vacation.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, there you go. Brady or Manning?
Andy Moore: Neither.
Neil Dudley: No neither. You got to pick.
Andy Moore: Manning.
Neil Dudley: Jordan or James?
Brett Wilson: Jordan.
Neil Dudley: Mac computer or PC? I’m a PC man. East or west coast?
Cole Parks: West.
Neil Dudley: Whitetail or elk?
Tanner Spears: Elk.
Neil Dudley: Dove or quail?
Justin Holland: Quail.
Neil Dudley: Coffee or tea?
Lee Gore: Tea.
Neil Dudley: NFL or NBA?
Andy Moore: College. I guess the NFL.
Neil Dudley: More people or less people?
Brett Wilson: More people.
Neil Dudley: Mexico or Canada? I think I got to go with Canada. Mountains or beach?
Cole Parks: Mountains.
Neil Dudley: Steak or bacon?
Tanner Spears: Steak.
Neil Dudley: Beef or pork?
Justin Holland: Beef.
Neil Dudley: Ball cap or none?
Lee Gore: 10 years ago, straight up ball cap. Now, still ball cap.
Neil Dudley: This one, Andy may not get this one. This one kind of needed to be a kid, somebody with kids already, but you’ll get it quick enough. Frozen or Shrek?
Andy Moore: Shrek.
Neil Dudley: Country or pop?
Brett Wilson: Country.
Cole Parks: Lady Gaga, she sings pop, just so you know.
Brett Wilson You’re right.
Neil Dudley: Stand or kneel? Stand. Okay. So that’s all the quickfire stuff. Now I’ve got a few topics to just think about. Maybe we should do this- We’ll see if we can get around because this could get a little bit hard to do. Cole, name one thing you appreciate about America.
Cole Parks: Independence.
Neil Dudley: Tanner, same question.
Tanner Spears: Freedom.
Lee Gore: The love of mankind.
Neil Dudley: Andy?
Andy Moore: I got to go with freedom.
Justin Holland: Ditto, freedom.
Neil Dudley: Everybody appreciates freedom. So, I think that’s- this next question pretty much, we’ll kind of dig a little deeper on that. What’s more important in America, freedom of speech or right to bear arms? Cole?
Cole Parks: That’s a tricky one.
Neil Dudley: When you think about it too long, you think wrong.
Lee Gore: There’s no right or wrong.
Neil Dudley: That’s right.
Cole Parks: Are you going to make me pick like you did Andy?
Neil Dudley: I wonder if, is it impossible to say, if you had to give one up, this is all hypothetical stuff. If you had to lose one of those two things, which would you give up? Freedom of speech or right to bear arms? Man, we’ve got them perplexed. I wish y’all were here. They got just real silent and thoughtful all of a sudden. Okay, we’ll come back to that one. Favorite exotic animal, Tanner?
Tanner Spears: Axis.
Neil Dudley: Justin?
Justin Holland: Chocolate spotted fallow.
Neil Dudley: Lee?
Lee Gore: Wildebeest.
Neil Dudley: Andy?
Andy Moore: Scimitar. But back on that, chocolate spotted fallow, is it big or little?
Neil Dudley: Got to be off the tit. Brett?
Brett Wilson: Axis for sure.
Neil Dudley: I don’t even know. I mean, so-
Lee Gore: You have to pick one.
Neil Dudley: I’m a terrible candidate on this one. What’d y’all say? Oh, I thought that Texas dall was kind of interesting. I mean, it reminds me of Rambouillet sheep. I’m like, damn, I could have killed a million. We could have sold those sons of bitches for lots of money. Even Angora goats will get them really big horns. Okay. Cole?
Cole Parks: Moose.
Neil Dudley: Moose. Johnny?
Johnny Peterson: Snow leopard.
Neil Dudley: Snow leopard. Okay, cool. If you had to move out of America, where would you go? Tanner?
Tanner Spears: I guess, Mexico.
Neil Dudley: Justin?
Justin Holland: Australia maybe, New Zealand. One of those two.
Lee Gore: You know this answer, Dudley, Copenhagen, Denmark.
Neil Dudley: Andy?
Andy Moore: Brazil.
Brett Wilson: I’m headed to south America as well.
Neil Dudley: South America. I’m pretty sure I’d go to Australia, although I’ve never been, I think it just seems like a similar place to where I am today. Cole?
Cole Parks: I’d be South America also.
Neil Dudley: And what about you, Johnny? California? That was a joke. That was joke for all your California listeners, I’m just kidding.
Johnny Peterson: I’d probably go New Zealand, too.
Neil Dudley: Alright, here we go. Since we couldn’t get very far on the other one, let’s go for a little more thoughtful one. One thing you would tell yourself 10 years ago if you could go back. Lee?
Lee Gore: Learn to forget and forgive much quicker and better.
Neil Dudley: That’s so sweet. But it is a real thing. I think that’d be a good thing to tell yourself, anybody if you’re listening, if he could go back 10 years ago, that’s what he’d tell himself. So think about that. Andy?
Andy Moore: Spend more time with my dad.
Neil Dudley: See, I don’t do enough of that. My dad’s five steps from my house and I spend enough time with him. Brett?
Brett Wilson: I would probably tell myself to quit being so selfish.
Neil Dudley: Alright, so now it’s on me. I think if I could go back 10 years ago and tell myself, I would say think bigger. Cole?
Cole Parks: I had plenty of time to think about this as y’all were going around. Y’all had some really good ones. I’d say get my wife down the aisle faster.
Neil Dudley: Yup. That’s- Johnny, we can’t put that one in here.
Cole Parks: This is a public podcast, right?
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that’s right.
Brett Wilson: Hey, what’d you do, Cole?
Neil Dudley: Tanner, Justin did y’all come up with one while we were going around?
Justin Holland: Lee’s was pretty good. I’d say something along those lines. Forgive and forget.
Neil Dudley: Forgive and forget quicker.
Tanner Spears: Yeah, that’s pretty good one. I’ll have ditto that one.
Neil Dudley: Let’s see. I got one more thing I think, and then we can all be done with this punishment. This one I really love. And it’s not going to be- Well anyways, let’s just do it. Name one thing you could give your child that they could have the rest of their life. One thing you would give your child they can have for the rest of their life, just guaranteed. Doesn’t have to be material. It could be an attitude. It could be anything. Name one thing you’d give them they could have forever. Tanner?
Tanner Spears: Good health.
Andy Moore: Amen to that.
Neil Dudley: Justin?
Justin Holland: Make sure they love the Lord.
Neil Dudley: Well, that’s a good one. Definitely.
Lee Gore: I would second that right there, a hundred percent, know their Lord and savior.
Neil Dudley: Andy, you got any thoughts on that one? We just wait until your baby gets here and then we can ask you the question?
Andy Moore: No, I got to third that.
Neil Dudley: Third that, alright. Love the Lord with all your heart.
Brett Wilson: Hard to say anything else, but I’ll say honesty.
Neil Dudley: Honesty, yep. You know what, if I could just plug anything into my girls, it would be self-esteem. I would give them that forever. Cole?
Cole Parks: I like all y’all’s answers equally as much, but I would also add persistence, unwavering persistence.
Neil Dudley: Sweet. Alright, fellas, thank you so much. It’s been a fun time hanging out with you. To all the listeners, I hope you enjoyed that. That was a little bit of entertainment and also maybe some things to think about, that perspectives these guys have on life, liberty. Oh, come on, let’s go back to that one. Let’s still try to decide. I’ve got one in my mind. Y’all want me to say what I think? If you had to give up one, would you give up freedom of speech or right to bear arms? So, do I have to start it or does anybody got one they’re willing to just jump off and say?
Cole Parks: Alright, well, we’ve been listening to a lot of Roy D. Mercer this weekend.
Neil Dudley: We have been.
Cole Parks: I guess if I got to give one up, I’ll take freedom of speech to maintain, and I’ll give up to the right to bear arms. I’ll give up the right to bear arms. I’m pretty big. How big a boy are you?
Neil Dudley: You’re bearing arms all the time, aren’t you? That’s a pretty good perspective. How about, you got a different one, Tanner? Any thoughts? Justin?
Lee Gore: I’m going to give up speech because if I got my bear arms, I can make my point happen if I have to. I can protect the family. I can still provide food to put on the table. You can still do things that a country boy can survive.
Neil Dudley: I didn’t say that arms were going to disappear, just your right to have them would disappear. See, I think you should keep freedom of speech. Just that thing can be more valuable in a bigger, on a bigger stage, in a bigger way.
Lee Gore: But is that true? Because you look at today, is the freedom of speech today, and I should not go down this road. Holy cow. Is the freedom of speech today being used properly to be understood what really is needing to happen, or is it being abused or put out there as a way to patronize something that’s really not being handled properly?
Neil Dudley: I think that’s the risk of it. Yeah. You have to think freedom of speech, like what is that exactly?
Lee Gore: And I’m not, and I’m taking from younger generations this thing, I mean, we know what our grandparents and great-grandparents talked about from when they went through the Depression, World Wars, Vietnam, things that we heard firsthand information from our great-grandparents, our grandparents when we were kids. Does the culture below us or the younger generations really understand what freedom of speech really means in knowing what those people did for our world in our country when they stood up and fought for rights properly, instead of doing the things that’s going on now in our country?
Neil Dudley: Yeah. That is a really deep conversation. It’s a deep thing to think about. I encourage anybody listening to spend some time just thinking about that, about where you stand, because there are a million different perspectives.
Lee Gore: I’m not against what people do. I’m not saying it’s good, bad, or ugly. I’m just saying everyone should listen. And everyone’s going to have an opinion because there’s eight of us here. We don’t all agree on everything. But you just got to learn to listen and listen well, listen big, but at the same time, people need to reciprocate that listening tool.
Neil Dudley: Awesome. Okay so, Johnny, let’s put down one little commercial for Signature Hunting Company who hosted us and took care of us this weekend.
Lee Gore: Signature Hunting Company, it’s on Facebook, you can find Kyle Crouch and his team on the internet. They’re down in South Texas, a true top-notch outfitter, great accommodations, great hunting, great guides, even better food. And man, you better bring you a lot of water because you’re going to drink a lot of beer.
Neil Dudley: Don’t bring your virgin ears because they they’ll cuss. Alright. Hey, but I really guarantee you’re going to have a good time. Look them up. Send them some money. They’ll take you hunting.
Lee Gore: Yeah. Family-friendly, kid-friendly. I brought my wife down here. She’s shot some animals with me. His kids around here some. I mean, it’s a good place for any family, any person, businesses, individuals, the whole thing.
Neil Dudley: Hey, everybody, this is Johnny Peterson. He’s the guy behind the scenes helping the Cowboy Perspective stay on top of our game. Johnny, tell everybody who you are and where you come from. And then we might dive into some of the things that you learned or kind of experienced on this South Texas dove hunting trip when you kind of went along to help me record some of the conversations with the other guys.
Johnny Peterson: Cool. Well, Neil, thanks so much for having me. I really appreciate it. And I want to say right off the bat, it’s an absolute pleasure working with you. I think we’ve been working together for a little over a year now.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that’s crazy. It’s been a year.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah. And I mean, the range of guests that you have and the type of content that you’re putting out on your podcast is never something that I personally would have ever sought out on my own. So being able to be entrenched in that on a weekly basis and seeing the type of people that you’re talking to has opened my eyes up to an entire different world. I mean, the cowboy world is not something I’m familiar with, even though I live here. So that kind of ties into who I am. I’m born and raised in San Diego, California. So about as far away from cowboys as you can get. Living on the west coast, growing up on the water, I was more of a beach boy than I was a cowboy. And I don’t know what it was, but I knew growing up, and we’ve talked about this before, for some reason I’d never been to Texas, I just knew in the back of my mind my entire life, I’m going to end up in Texas. That’s where I wanted to go. And so, college rolls around. I was playing basketball at the time, and I applied to TCU. I applied to UT Austin, got rejected from both schools and decided to take my chances playing Division III basketball in Los Angeles, did that for a year. It wasn’t for me. And then spent another year at home, doing community college, trying to figure out what I wanted to do. And thankfully, I was admitted to TCU, moved out to Fort Worth, and I’ve been here ever since for the past five years. And then when it comes to what I do now in terms of my career is podcast production. And I had always, I loved podcasts ever since about 2016, 2017, when they got introduced to me. And I knew that I didn’t know what I wanted to do with my life. And I think that that’s a problem that a lot of young kids are going through right now. And I said, okay, I know I want to, I love this idea of podcasting. I love this industry. I love what it can do for people. How can I make money doing this? And that’s something that people have told me throughout my life. I’ve had some great mentors growing up, and I come from a family, both my parents are doctors, and I don’t know what your thought is, but the stigma of having parents as doctors, you kind of, the going stigma is that you get pushed into being a doctor if your parents are doing that. Same with lawyers, same with kind of politicians, same with like you’re going to go into the family business whatever your parents are doing. My parents were the exact opposite. They said find something that you love to do. If it’s not medicine, go find something else. You don’t have to be a doctor. You don’t have to be a lawyer. And so, I said I love podcasting, I want to do this. And so, I just jumped right headfirst into it. I started my own show about basketball because that was kind of my closest level of expertise on something. So, I was like, alright, I’ll do a basketball podcast and just try and figure this thing out. And I’m sitting in class one day, my senior year, and I mentioned it in class. I think the professor had asked us if we were doing anything outside of class that we thought was productive that wasn’t being in a fraternity and going drinking every day. And I said, I have a podcast, and she goes, “Hey, that’s really cool. By the way, see me after class.” I thought I was in trouble. And so, I come up after class and she asked to hear a little more about the show, who I am, because it was like the first few weeks of class. And she said, “Well, hey, there’s an alumni that actually reached out to me about a week ago, asking if there was anyone here that could help him start a podcast. Do you mind meeting with him?” And so, I said this is my in, this is how I start doing this. I’m not going to get paid for having my own show, but I can maybe get paid helping other people do podcasts to where all they really need to do is just sit down and start talking, and I take care of the rest. So, I put together an entire outline. I set up one meeting with the guy and I did a lot of background research on it. And I figured out who he was, what his business was, looked at his website, the type of business that he does. And so, he did industrial real estate transactions and development. So, I put together an entire podcast without him knowing anything. And I bring him this one sheet of about 10 different names for the podcasts, about a couple paragraphs of what his show should be about, and five or ten people that he should reach out to to be a guest. And he looks at the paper and he looks at me, and he says, “You’re hired.” And to this day, he always tells me, he says that one meeting was what got you in, how prepared you were walking into that meeting was what set you off.
Neil Dudley: Now, I was going to say that was for a college kid, just me hearing this, I never heard the story before, that sounds impressive to me that you would kind of take that time to do the research. Like I think about me and my college years, I had opportunities or if I had had opportunities like that, I’d probably have just went in there winging it and being like, hey man, yeah, sure, I do a podcast, you want to listen to it? Instead, you took something that the guy just had no choice but to say you’re hired. So that’s probably, well, that’s absolutely one reason you’re still doing it today. And I’m lucky to have you working with me on this thing.
Johnny Peterson: Thank you. And it was, one thing led to another, and now, about six months into that relationship with this host, his name is Chris Powers, he said to me podcasting has a huge future and you’re really talented and you provide something that a lot of people can’t get right away just by watching YouTube videos. So, let’s start a business together. So, we went in together, we started a business, and that was about 18 months ago. And now I went from one podcast, just his, to now producing about a dozen right now and keeping on growing.
Neil Dudley: Yeah. Well, you do a good job. So, anybody listening, if you’re wanting to put on or start a podcast or take your podcast that you’re already kind of dabbling with and playing with, I mean, Johnny told me what mics to get. I had probably, what did I do? One or two before I kind of found you and started saying, hey, help me do this a little better. And man, you can listen to some of my early episodes, and you can see really quick when Johnny came on board and started helping.
Johnny Peterson: And it’s not really like, it looks confusing at the outset, but for you, everyone who’s doing a podcast, it’s not their full-time job for the majority of people. So, you still have your entire life outside of the podcast that you got to worry about. You don’t have the time to go, alright, what type of mic should I get? Okay. What’s the recording environment need to look like? How do I edit? How do I- what’s the best way to get this podcast out to the world? What do my analytics look like? Things like that. So having someone-
Neil Dudley: Yeah, the editing part is I would be completely no good at. That’s the piece that you do so well that really helps me because I can just jumble a bunch of sh- stuff together. Pardon my French. And then, you end up just making it make sense and taking out the stuff that doesn’t need to be there. Making it a good customer, which the customer in this situation is the listener, a good customer experience.
Johnny Peterson: The customer is also you. I got to make sure that your life is as easy as possible. So, all you need to do is just find somebody you want to talk to, know what you want to talk about, get things recorded, and then shift over to me. And then boom, four or five days later, you’ve got a full podcast episode with music, it sounds great, it’s ready to go, and it’s off your plate once you’ve hit stop.
Neil Dudley: Yeah. And I would say I listen to Chris’s podcast, and for anybody out there that’s interested in real estate or just kind of entrepreneurial business, he had a lady on the other day that runs an administration company for big hedge funds and people like that. Her insights into team building were really cool. I took a lot from that. So, I think podcasts are cool in that way. It’s kind of a real estate-based podcast, but the guy selling bacon found a lot of value in it. So, I hope the Cowboy Perspective can do that in some ways, like almost anybody can find a little value in thinking about it the way people I know think about it.
Johnny Peterson: Well, I mean, it’s helped me a ton, too. Like I said before, I’m not a cowboy guy. I didn’t grow up in the South. I didn’t grow up on ranches like you and all of the guests that you’ve had on, but listening to you talk to guys like Ty and Butch Murray and Billy Albin and listening to their stories, there’s a real central theme around everything, which says you find something that you really care about doing, and you go do that. Why would you waste your time trying to chase a paycheck doing something that you hate when you could do something that you actually love. And I think that’s the way you enjoy life. So, it’s not necessarily cowboy stuff that I learned, but it’s stuff about life that I learned, which has been super valuable to me.
Neil Dudley: Yeah. Those life lessons I took for granted a lot of them that I was taught just over time. I think kids today, like even parents, I would challenge parents to understand it takes a million repetitions of getting a kid to learn something. I mean, my dad just never gave up on me. He kept telling me pick that tool up, put it back where it goes. No, if you’re going to bother doing it, do it good. Do that again. He didn’t just do that once, he did that 500 times. Until one day I got into the workforce, and it was a natural thing for me, which gave me a leg up in the workforce and in building businesses and all those kinds of things. Tell us a little bit about how much hunting you’ve done in your life.
Johnny Peterson: Absolutely zero.
Neil Dudley: So, okay, this was a cool thing for me. I like the idea of Johnny got to come help me record some stuff, but he also got to experience something that maybe you wouldn’t have otherwise or at least haven’t before.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah, I mean, well, it’s funny, my dad is huge into hunting and he and my younger brother go all the time, and he actually has bought some land in Michigan. And he, I think for the last two years, has just been begging me to come out and go hunting with him. He’s like, “Come on, Johnny. You’ll love it. You’ll love it. You’ll love it.” And for some reason it just was never something that interested me, not that I was against like killing animals or anything, which is I think the idea that he got. So, he thought that I was kind of a wuss and was like, “Okay, well you don’t have to shoot anything if you come.” And I’m like, it has nothing to do with shooting the animal or not. It’s just it wasn’t something that interested me. But then I don’t know what happened. When you shot me the invitation, I was like, yeah, this sounds like a great time. And in terms of the hunting that he had mentioned and the hunting that we did were two completely different things. So, I mean, my dad is big into elk, deer, bear hunting, where you’re sitting in a tree blind at 5:00 AM, sitting in the freezing cold. You can’t make a sound, you can’t do anything. Which is the complete opposite of what we did down in Bandera, which was, I mean, you’re hanging out with all your buddies.
Neil Dudley: It’s almost like a party.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah. Cracking open a beer and then a flock of birds will fly by, and you all just swing, turn, pull, done.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that’s right. Well, that’s one reason I like dove hunting and bird hunting. I think dove hunting may be kind of unique in that regard. Quail hunting is a little different; you got to be moving. I can’t say I’ve ever done much duck hunting or pheasant hunting, but they’re all a lot different. Because I don’t know, you got to be moving or the birds have to kind of fly right over you, or dove, big groups of them come in. Anyways, it’s one of those things that I learned from my dad. My dad liked going dove hunting. He didn’t really do any other kind of hunting, dove hunting was about it, and maybe just shooting varmints and that kind of thing. He wasn’t a big deer hunter, never went on these big hunts into Colorado and hiking the mountains and camping out for a week. So dove hunting was just the thing I got to do. So, I’m glad that was kind of a unique experience. Going into it, what were you expecting? Did you have any kind of picture in your mind what it was going to be like?
Johnny Peterson: I had no idea. I knew that I was just open to anything. I knew that no matter what, even if I didn’t get a single bird, I was going to try and have a good time. I was really focused on making sure that the podcasting part of it went as smoothly as possible, because I mean, that’s why I was there. So, I knew it was partly for pleasure, partly for business. But podcasting is always on my brain. So, I was really thinking about, okay, as soon as we walked in, I was like, okay, this is where we’re going to record. Do I have everything? What’s going to be the best setup? How should these mics be arranged? Things like that. So, I was open to pretty much whatever was going to happen during the actual hunting portion of it, but I was really concerned with how well the podcasting was going to go. I wanted to make sure that that went off without a hitch, because I mean, that’s my job. And if I go down there and I screw that up, then that’s going to ruin the weekend for everybody else. And I probably won’t get invited back.
Neil Dudley: I mean, it was a tough thing. People are shy. Like the most flamboyant, talkative, opinionated people, you put a mic in front of them and say we’re fixing to record this, they clam up. It takes a minute to get them just kind of comfortable talking and some of that. And then in this particular situation, you kind of start getting going. I’m like, a couple of times like, man, we’re getting going, this is kind of, we’re fixing to start getting some really good stuff. And then, the guide walks in or something and says, hey, time to go or- So, everybody just, it’s easy to get distracted. That might be one thing we could, if we ever do it again, think about how do we avoid that piece of it? Because we know it takes a good ramping up amount of time to get people kind of loosened up and just talking. But people have great insights on stuff. We got to talking about how they hired people and what they thought when they were looking for people to add to their organizations. That was great insight. It just kind of got cut short. And at least to me, of course, I’m always thinking, man, we could get a little more value out of that conversation.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah, and maybe it’s finding the balance between- What’s great about having everyone there behind the microphone at the same time is that everyone has a different perspective, the Cowboy Perspective, of what that situation or whatever the topic is that we’re talking about. So maybe the easiest way to move forward to still keep that sort of, that whiteboard session of bouncing ideas off of each other is we just break it down into smaller groups. So maybe it’s you, Cole, Andy, and Lee in the room. You go for 10 minutes and then you cycle out, three more guys in, keep talking about different topics, things like that. That way people have time to kind of hang out, do their thing. And at the same time, not everyone’s waiting to get a word in edgewise. Because with so many people behind the mic at the same time, it’s tough for everyone to give a really deep, insightful answer.
Neil Dudley: Oh yeah, sure. There’s a couple of guys that are more quiet just in their natural personality, and they probably have good thoughts, but by the time everybody else gets done talking, they’re kind of like, well, we’ve kind of talked this topic to death. So, I don’t really, never mind, I don’t have anything to say, which they probably still did. But anyways, it was fun. I loved every bit of it. You did make it easy for us to do. Oh yeah, where’d you learn to gamble like that?
Johnny Peterson: Man, that was probably the best part of the entire trip was playing cards. I think everyone kind of, at a very high level, everyone kind of knows what gambling is, but once you drill down and start to find games that you like and that you’re good at, that’s what really kind of gets you the bug. I actually only started really gambling in the beginning of the Coronavirus. So, I was in Hawaii. I was in Hawaii March 15th to 18th when it started to really pick up, and everyone was starting to go, okay, is the world’s going to end? What’s happening here? And I think for every night straight for about two weeks, we were playing poker with me, my girlfriend, and her extended family. And I don’t know if you know anything about the Hawaiian culture or sort of Pacific Islander culture, but they are huge on going to Vegas. That is like the, that is the biggest pastime for those people is to go to Vegas because I think there’s some law about gambling in Hawaii. But I mean, they’re going to Vegas 3, 4, 5 times a year to go blow money at the casinos.
Neil Dudley: This is probably offensive. I don’t know the ethnicity of everybody, but Vegas, Asians are I think almost the inventors of gambling. The Asian cultures, man, they come to Vegas. What would you call Hawaiians?
Johnny Peterson: Polynesian, Hawaiian, Pacific. I think Hawaiian is probably safe.
Neil Dudley: So, the crazy world we live in. We got to talking about some of those things on the recording while we’re on that dove hunt. And some of that didn’t get recorded. That was just like, man, crazy world. What’s going on here?
Johnny Peterson: Well, when it comes to the crazy world thing, and I mean, I podcast so often that I feel like I can kind of, it’s a skill that you have to learn to sort of stay neutral when you’re talking about these kinds of things. But the biggest realization I think that people aren’t thinking about anymore is what happened between coronavirus starting and today to where we all decided that we cannot, we’re not allowed to not agree on things anymore. That’s no longer on the table. You’re not allowed to say, you know what? I don’t really agree with what you just said. I don’t have to give a reason for it. Maybe I will and maybe it’s really thought out, but I don’t have to. But for some reason, we’ve lost that. Now it’s everyone has to agree with every single thing and every single policy, whatever it is, and I mean, the world doesn’t operate like that. And I don’t know what happened to people’s brains to where they think that that’s something that’s feasible.
Neil Dudley: Well, and I think post-COVID, post-Black Lives Matter – I guess the word post is wrong – just being in the middle of these kinds of movements, which are valuable and valid, I start waking up and realizing, dang, I have just some parts of my vocabulary and way of speaking probably hurt people’s feelings or come across as offensive. And I don’t want to be, and I also don’t want to be the guy that never says anything because he’s scared he’s going to hurt somebody’s feelings. I mean, you got to go ahead and forgive and forget, and it points to what you were just saying is, look everybody, hit the release valve a little bit.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah, everyone needs to just relax for five seconds. We all just need to take a deep breath and kind of dial it back with the- We just need to deescalate. Everything just needs to calm down a little bit. But yeah, we had some great conversations both on and off the podcast. I think if we were to do that again, those same guys would be a lot more comfortable sitting down because now they’ve done this before, and now, they’re like, okay, I know what we’re getting into.
Neil Dudley: I’m really looking forward to putting this out and letting them hear what comes of it, then they’re going to think, I would bet they’ll be like, hey Neil, let’s try that again because I got some stuff I think I could help add to the conversation. Well, I mean, I just want to tell everybody, if you haven’t listened to any R.D. Mercer, lately, go find, look it up on YouTube. Yeah, how big a boy are ya? Anyways, we had a lot of fun listening to that on the drive home and there in the lodge. And I think you and I were just listening to podcasts. You were like, hey, let’s listen to this one. I was like, ooh, I listened to this one the other day. And the guy riding with us, Brett, he was at the end of it like, man, I’m going to start listening, this was fun, I enjoyed this. And you don’t think about it. Like I think about listening to podcasts a lot because I’ve got this commute.
Johnny Peterson: And I work in it, so I’m always listening to podcasts. So, it’s interesting because podcasting has been around since technically 2004, but when you think about it now, there are still people now, even with the amount of money being put into this industry with Spotify, Anchor, all of these companies that are coming up, there are still people, like we met Brett, who was saying you know what, I don’t really listen to podcasts. Like I have a meeting with a kid tomorrow who wants to intern for me. And he just said I don’t know anything about podcasts, but they sound really interesting, and I may want to come intern for you. So, it’s just there’s always people finding out about podcasts, and it makes me think that this industry is still definitely in its infancy. So, I’m really excited that we’re sort of in on it early.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, and I feel like I’m in late. When you look at Rogan and Tim Ferriss and any of these guys that have thousands of episodes. I’m like, dang, I’m like 12 episodes in. But anyways, you just start, and you start plugging, and the next thing you know, we’re a year into this. We’ll be talking five years from now and saying, wow, we really did this for five years; that went by fast. I run into people or people will be like, Neil, somebody said I should listen to your podcast, what is that? I’m like I don’t know, it’s a podcast. It’s a radio show without the radio. If you run into somebody, just tell them, hey, open your iPhone up, look at this little purple app here, that’s the podcast app. And there’s a million others, like you mentioned, Spotify – see I’m not even familiar with most of them.
Johnny Peterson: Well, I mean, the one that- So you had a great idea and then this is for the guys on the trip listening now, you guys should have listened to the episode that Neil told us to listen to. That was one of the best podcast episodes bar none that I’ve listened to ever. It was incredible.
Neil Dudley: Jeez almighty, we didn’t even talk about it. I told them all. I said, hey, everybody, listen to this podcast episode, we’re going to talk about it. And we never did that.
Johnny Peterson: I’m going to link it for those of you listening now, I’ll link it in the show notes. So, if you just scroll down a little bit, a link to that episode will pop up. But it was, I mean, they talked about everything – about what you need to do to diversify, investing, what the world is like now, geopolitical perspectives I guess, or potentials that could come out of what’s happening right now. And then talking about the guy’s life, it is the author of Rich Dad Poor Dad, which is I haven’t read the book, but that was, the guy is just-
Neil Dudley: That was one of the first business books I ever actually read. I’ve only probably read two or three books ever. That was one of them. But yeah, the podcast, let’s just tell everybody so that you get to hear it – Brad Lea Dropping Bombs with Robert Kiyosaki. Go find that episode. I really took a lot from it. I like Brad Lea’s Dropping Bombs podcast. He’s an interesting guy. I agree with a lot of his perspectives. He’s led me to a lot of other people – Andy Frisella, Grant Cardone. I mean, there’s just, kind of what I find fun is getting kind of one guy, and then when he gets guests, go check that guest out. Maybe listen to the other thing they’re doing. They all seem to have their own podcast now.
Johnny Peterson: And I think what makes people like that so popular and why people enjoy your podcast and enjoy podcasting in general and why it’s becoming such a popular medium is that it allows people to be very, for lack of a better term, real. You’re listening to people who are straight shooters. They’re not trying to give you a spin on anything. They’re not trying to give you an angled perspective on some topic. They’re just telling you how it is from their line or their point of view, and I think people find that very refreshing. They don’t feel like they’re being lied to.
Neil Dudley: Yeah. Well, you trust people you feel like you know way more than you trust a stranger. And I think a podcast, which I tend to be like, man, I want my podcast to go on for a little while. And there’s a lot of great podcasts out there that are 10-minute just thoughts, stuff for you to work on and think about, or just be entertained by. I love the Armchair Expert Dax Shephard. I listen to that a lot. And people will think, well, all you got to do is get a mic and start talking, which that’s pretty much all I did. And I think it probably shows. I haven’t done a whole lot of work on myself in getting to be a great interviewer or improving my skillset for the podcast. But Dax, I mean, that’s his livelihood. He’s working at it. Joe does the same thing. They’re putting time into the questions they ask their guests. I guarantee they have plans for those conversations, where they want them to go.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah. And for people, I mean, people listening now, one of the biggest hiccups, and I’m sure, Neil, you felt the same way for taking the leap to actually start a podcast and get the microphone and sit down and start to interview people, is you have this internal fear of what if I’m not good at it? I’ve never done this before. Well, yes, same with everybody else who started a podcast. So, if you look back at Rogan’s early episodes, he’s wearing that headset that you’re wearing now to talk to me through Zoom, but he’s recording his audio through that. And it sounds like shit. And he’s talking about whatever. And it’s just something that you start doing and you get better at over time. It’s the same thing. It’s with sports, it’s with work, it’s with lifting weights, exercising – you start at zero and the more you do it, the more reps you put into it, the better you get at it, until a year and a half later where you are now, you probably feel a lot more comfortable popping the mic right in front of your face than you did when you first started.
Neil Dudley: Yeah, that makes me think of Gary V. I think probably the reason I started a podcast was I was listening to Gary Vaynerchuk, and he said be a practitioner, that every day you wait to start doing what you want, something, you’re just putting off progress. So, I said, shit man, I’m going to start something, just start doing it. And if it’s terrible, the result or the thing that I’m after is actually the education. So, who cares if it’s terrible, I’m getting the education. And it turns out, I’ve enjoyed it.
Johnny Peterson: You figure it out along the way, too. I mean, you don’t walk into it thinking, okay, I have to know everything right off the bat. You just start and you just, and that’s the same thing – starting a business, doing anything, going to school. It’s you just start, and you figure it out as you go, and you get better.
Neil Dudley: I was curious. It was kind of an interesting group of guys, I like them all, I really enjoyed them. Was there anybody – I don’t, I think you could say this without hurting anybody’s feelings – was there any particular person you’re kind of just like, man, that guy, I kind of would like to pick his brain some more on things?
Johnny Peterson: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, first of all, I just want to say to all the guys that were with us on the trip, they were so welcoming, and no one, I mean, I was the youngest guy there by probably 15 years, and they were just super nice to me. No one really messed- I mean, they messed with me as they got to know me and that’s just guys being guys, but I always felt included throughout the weekend. And I think that was maybe something that I felt a little hesitant about, knowing that all you guys know each other and I’m sort of the new guy coming in. But in terms of people that I, I mean, all the guys were great. I really liked talking to Cole and Brett. I think those guys, I mean, Cole was one of those dudes that has a story for everything. I mean, I could talk to that dude for hours. You just bring up one topic and the dude’s got a litany of stories that he could tell you, and they just make you laugh your head off, and Brett’s the same way. I was really excited to see how successful everybody was in their own field, whether it was chiropractory, whether it was in the hunting industry with Kyle, with Lee. I mean, I didn’t even know they sold bacteria to dairy farms. I had no idea what the hell he was talking about, but it was just fascinating what he was telling me.
Neil Dudley: It illustrates, I think for everybody listening, there is so much opportunity out there for you to do the thing you love and find a way to monetize it and find a way to take care of your family through that. It’s just around that table, there’s so many different industries, so many different ways. Now we all, see, that was kind of one of the things that I never even thought about except just now hearing you mention it, kind of being hesitant – oh, well, how will they accept me and stuff? I think that’s a little bit of a cowboy thing, or at least has been in my experience, is they pretty much always accept you until you prove you shouldn’t be. It’s kind of like you’re accepted until you prove you shouldn’t be and then you won’t be. Where there’s a lot of, kind of I think maybe some other situations play out where nobody’s accepted until they prove they should be. It just hadn’t been my experience.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah. And I mean, you kind of have to accept somebody. If they’re going to be under the same roof as you for 72 hours, you kind of got to be like, alright, I’m going to work with you. And if we don’t like each other, we’ll find out in 72 hours or we’ll find out really quick.
Neil Dudley: And it won’t be so- even if we don’t, we can survive it.
Johnny Peterson: Yeah, you know there’s an end to it. But yeah, it was an awesome time. But yeah, I think talking to guys like Cole and Brett, I had the opportunity to talk to them the most out of anybody out of the weekend. And so, I’d be, I don’t know, I had a great time talking with everybody.
Neil Dudley: What about going and seeing some of those exotic game animals? Had you ever been around and done that? I never really had done that.
Johnny Peterson: I hadn’t done that before, but it was so cool seeing how that there was an industry just to do that where it’s like, hey, you want to go get an exotic animal to get a rug for it or to mount on your wall or just to try some exotic meat, here’s an industry that we’ve built doing this. And that’s something that ties back to this theme that we have on this episode is what Kyle was doing. I mean, you got to go out and do that. I mean, no one’s just going to walk up to you and say, hey, do you want to do this for me? He actually went out and made that happen for himself. And I mean, he clearly loves what he does and is having a ball doing it.
Neil Dudley: Oh, I mean, and so just kind of a real side note, the gun racks that they had in those ATVs, I wanted one, so I called the guy that makes them, and now I’ve made a friend. I mean, he’s like a 78-year-old guy that makes gun racks. And he’s the coolest thing. He’s an old kind of engineer, farmer, rancher. So anyways, it’s like if you’re open to the idea in life of just experiencing it, there’s so much out there for you. Johnny Peterson, thanks for everything you do for my podcast. Thanks for going down to South Texas and helping us get this episode recorded. And thanks for spending some time on here, telling everybody a little bit about what you do and what you think about things, your perspective.
Johnny Peterson: I appreciate it, Neil. Thank you so much. And thanks for having me on, and thanks for keeping me employed, partially. So, I do appreciate that.
Neil Dudley: I can’t be in charge of all of it, but I’ll take my fair share.
Well, we came to the end of another episode of the Cowboy Perspective. Please subscribe. If you liked it, tell a friend. If you found any value, go out there, share the show. That’s how we get the word out. Tell people about the people I have that are sponsoring the show that, if you heard commercial in there and you thought, ooh, that was interesting, well go check that out. All in all, it was a lot of fun for me. I certainly enjoyed the trip, thanks to Kyle and his bunch of guys there at Signature Hunting Company. Go check them out for sure. Johnny, thanks for going and helping us get the podcast put together. And I know the editing room was a lot tougher on this particular one. At the end of the day, I just want to say thank you so much for listening. Please tell me anything you do or don’t like, if you get a chance. That feedback’s invaluable or certainly very valuable. And until next time, I hope you enjoyed this group of guys shooting the bull. Thanks for listening.
The Cowboy Perspective is produced by Neil Dudley and Straight Up Podcasts. Graphics are done by Root & Roam Creative Studio, and the music is by Byron Hill Music.